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alexelian
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Re: Welcome to WCF forum

Post by alexelian » Thu Apr 20, 2017 13:30

Nadezhda Tervo wrote:
Thu Apr 20, 2017 8:41
First of all, congratulations with realization of very bright idea! Well done!

as mentioned, we have a lot Russian and non-English speaking breeders in WCF. Maybe we need to consider to make some non-English parts of forum, where people can ask questions in other language and still receive answers, which are not rumors, but true statements.
This is quite easy , you just open a subject in Russian . The rest of us can normally google translate if we want to get involved and maybe we can have a bilingual English/Russian moderator , such as yan or yelena to help . If we open a separate forum area in Russian , then the English and the Russian side will be completely disjointed, possibly with different answers to the same question . One of the main purposes of this forum is to re-unite the Russian and non Russian WCF
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Akcel
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Re: Welcome to WCF forum

Post by Akcel » Thu Apr 20, 2017 14:01

alexelian wrote:
Wed Apr 19, 2017 18:46
The format is not clear. one way is to have only one "delegate" per full member club have access and then each "delegate" can discuss internally within his club all the issues and the "delegate" can bring forward the arguments of his/her club for or against the proposal . Then we can even simulate GA voting. The other way is to have open access to all WCF members , which might bring a lot more interesting and different viewpoints, but then we would not really know how relevant this would be in terms of a future GA. But I am very very happy that this discussion has started.
I would propose to give access for 1 delegate from each club to make it more representful. This is the same way we make it at GA and I don't think it couses the problems within the club.

Akcel
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Re: Welcome to WCF forum

Post by Akcel » Thu Apr 20, 2017 14:07

alexelian wrote:
Wed Apr 19, 2017 18:51

but practically we then need first of all one/or more pretty dedicated administrators, hopefully somebody who is both a cat breeder/exhibitor or judge and also preferably a social media specialist (trust me, this is a profession!). The other issue is that we need to finally access the Russian/Ukrainian members, where the market is huge, but we are divided by the language. So should we have a "Russian" official page and a non Russian official page? Should English be the language of the non-Russian page, as its the language of Internet ?
Again ,this discussion proves by itself that the forum is useful !!
Several services do have pages in different languages at the same time. I believe it could be done in the following manner: the administrator of the main page makes a plan of posts and sends it to administrators of pages in other languages. Then other administrators translate it in the relevant language and post it in their group. I would propose to make an official WCF page in English language as a greator majority of WCF members do speak English. As for Russian language - I would definatly say yes, we need it. Simply becouse there are a lot of Russian-speaking members. I believe we could easily find a volunteer who can maintain info in Russian language up to date.

Bev Elian
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Re: Welcome to WCF forum

Post by Bev Elian » Thu Apr 20, 2017 14:38

Regarding point 5, Alexandra, it is not only I do not understand the purpose of national judge, but I think it was a very bad decision. I do not believe passing an exam makes you a judge, you only learn the basics at the point of taking an exam. You become a judge with experience and time, and that means that a new judge has to take as many engagements as possible to improve skills. Let us take a look at Romania as an example for a national judge. So a new judge has just passed their first category and has to be a national judge for 2 years, so limited to Romania. We have 4 shows a year. That means this new judge can only judge a maximum of 8 times in 2 years, sees the same cats each time, knows each and every breeder belonging to our club. What exoerience has this new judge accumulated?? Nothing for 2 years..................

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alexelian
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Re: Welcome to WCF forum

Post by alexelian » Thu Apr 20, 2017 15:34

Bev Elian wrote:
Thu Apr 20, 2017 14:38
Regarding point 5, Alexandra, it is not only I do not understand the purpose of national judge, but I think it was a very bad decision. I do not believe passing an exam makes you a judge, you only learn the basics at the point of taking an exam. You become a judge with experience and time, and that means that a new judge has to take as many engagements as possible to improve skills. Let us take a look at Romania as an example for a national judge. So a new judge has just passed their first category and has to be a national judge for 2 years, so limited to Romania. We have 4 shows a year. That means this new judge can only judge a maximum of 8 times in 2 years, sees the same cats each time, knows each and every breeder belonging to our club. What exoerience has this new judge accumulated?? Nothing for 2 years..................
the actual text is :5. Implementation of „national judges“ for the first 2 years respectively for judges without knowledge of foreign languages.
So I repeat my question: How did they pass the preliminary exam and the final exam?
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Rtishcheva
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Re: Welcome to WCF forum

Post by Rtishcheva » Thu Apr 20, 2017 17:40

5.-is for those judges who do not speak any foreign language(English, German). They are supposed to learn the language during their "national judging".
But I do not understand who and how the language will be evaluated.

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alexelian
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Re: Welcome to WCF forum

Post by alexelian » Thu Apr 20, 2017 18:00

Rtishcheva wrote:
Thu Apr 20, 2017 17:40
5.-is for those judges who do not speak any foreign language(English, German). They are supposed to learn the language during their "national judging".
But I do not understand who and how the language will be evaluated.
there are 2 questions here:
1. WCF does not have any procedure for a student judge to pass the final exam without knowing at least one of the 3 WCF languages (French, German, English). So How is the exam passed ?
2. Quite rightly, you ask your question: "what is the required standard of command of that language, and who evaluates it ?" I suppose the judges commission will have to make a proposal and the Board will have to decide.
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Rtishcheva
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Re: Welcome to WCF forum

Post by Rtishcheva » Thu Apr 20, 2017 22:41

1. I do not know how they managed to pass the exams. I can only guess. They might have learnt the answers from the catalogue by heart or...
2. It's just an assumption, there is no word about it in the rule/protocol.

Johan Lamprecht
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Re: Welcome to WCF forum

Post by Johan Lamprecht » Sun Apr 30, 2017 15:22

I think the intention behind the proposal to allow National Judges is a good one. Indeed, a similar proposal was made by CASA a number of years ago and it was not accepted then. It opens up the possibility for people who would make excellent judges, but do not have sufficient knowledge of one of the three official WCF languages.

It is very clear that the entrance exam questions, as well as the relevant questions for the written exam would have to be translated into the relevant language, before a student judge will receive permission to commence studies as a National Judge, rather than an International judge. It would me most practical to start with Russian, as I think that the greatest need would be there. It would not be practical in, for instance, our country (South Africa), as there are too few shows to use National Judges and there is no interest in the Cat Fancy by exclusive Zulu, Xhosa, etc. speakers. Afrikaans speakers are able to communicate adequately in English, without exception. It may, however be practical for Spain, Portugal, etc. if the teething problems have been sorted out by starting with Russian.

I am sure the Judges Commission will be able to initiate this, when necessary, for any candidate who is not able to write the exams and show reports in one of the three languages.

Johan Lamprecht

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